I think L4D2 is a definite improvement over L4D1, mainly due to increased variety of weapons (so no one else was bored with the same 6 weapons in the first one?) and the variety of zombies. The gore is much more what you would come to expect with something containing zombies, and the graphics are improved slightly.

Now for my biggest concern about Valve's newest game: Why have we seen nothing about Half Life 2 Episode 3, but they went to such great lengths (read: adding some new shit) to a game that has far less substance and originality than either of the Half Life games. I am really worried that Valve is getting too big of a head about their games. Do they not realize that Episode 3 is already turning out to be the next Duke Nukem Forever? But hey, at least we got occasional screens of DNF.

[Octillus]

Now for my biggest concern about Valve's newest game: Why have we seen nothing about Half Life 2 Episode 3, but they went to such great lengths (read: adding some new shit) to a game that has far less substance and originality than either of the Half Life games. I am really worried that Valve is getting too big of a head about their games. Do they not realize that Episode 3 is already turning out to be the next Duke Nukem Forever? But hey, at least we got occasional screens of DNF.

This is why I'm getting kind of burnt out on Valve. They're becoming flavor of the month, but in reality Half-Life is pretty much the only first person shooter I've ever been able to really play. The rest just make me angry.

[EphelDuath666]

I think L4D2 is a definite improvement over L4D1, mainly due to increased variety of weapons (so no one else was bored with the same 6 weapons in the first one?) and the variety of zombies. The gore is much more what you would come to expect with something containing zombies, and the graphics are improved slightly.

I agree, there's more weapons which is nice...but that still doesn't change a whole lot. I don't know, it just looks too much like the same thing again to me (run from one point to another and kill the zombies...I was hoping for a bit more story at least in the single player mode. Friends don't always have time when you do) and well, it gets released only 1 year after the first one as a full price game. So this just smells like it was all about the money. The half assed Crash Course add-on for part one already disappointed me.

as for Half Life Episode 3...I'd like to play that one too. But how about an actual Half Life 3? And a new engine?

Yea I was ranting about the engine the other day to my friends. How Valve seems so scared to give up their beloved Source engine in favor of something more...this generation.

They refuse to publish games for PS3, make a new engine, show anything for Half Life 2 Ep. 3, or Portal 2.

Sounds to me like Valve is on their last limb and hoping that their loyal fans will stick by them.

Also at this rate, we wont get a Half Life 3 until the next console generation. And hey, by that time they might actually be using a new engine for it!

[EphelDuath666]

Yea I was ranting about the engine the other day to my friends. How Valve seems so scared to give up their beloved Source engine in favor of something more...this generation.

agreed. As much as L4D2 may look better than the first one (and it's not THAT much better), the texture quality is a joke. Of course that is not the most important thing about a game but it could look soooooooo much better.

Oh well, maybe Left 4 Dead 3 will make a difference...unless they release it in one year again.

The Source engine has been constantly changed from 2004 to the present, they just change it to suit any improvements they need. I think they're planning one more Half-Life game after Episode 3, but I don't remember where I heard that. I wouldn't expect it for a long time, look how long it took between HL1 and HL2.

Really Episode 3 hasn't been that long if you look in the long term, its just not exactly "episodic". It just seems a lot longer because they haven't shown anything about it yet. That said I want it more than any other game.

As for a Portal sequel, its still soon after the first Portal, which doesn't sound like an excuse given they are releasing L4D2 so soon after the first. The one thing they need to improve is their gunplay, the models, animations and sound could be so much better than they are, but they keep it basic and bland most of the time.

They just employed the main developer behind DotA (Defense of the Ancients) a month or so ago, so they may be experimenting with something in that direction, which would be very different from what they usually do.

With Steam, Valve has a monopoly on the PC market, gaining money from sold games of many different developers and publishers, they made enough to spend $25,000,000 on advertising L4D2 alone.

If Valve are on their last limb, other developers are already dead in the ground.

[Octillus]

As for a Portal sequel, its still soon after the first Portal, which doesn't sound like an excuse given they are releasing L4D2 so soon after the first. The one thing they need to improve is their gunplay, the models, animations and sound could be so much better than they are, but they keep it basic and bland most of the time.

But they did do an expansion of it called Still Alive. Which just continues to show their support of flavor of the month (Portal was brilliant but still)

That was fan made, and free on PC. They just decided to distribute it on the 360 as well because it was so good.

[Octillus]

Oh. Statement withdrawn in that case then.

If Valve are on their last limb, other developers are already dead in the ground.

In terms of being a developer they are. Steam is generating money without a doubt, but why aren't they using said money to better their development studios? Why aren't they working on an engine that can compete with today's engines for most AAA titles?

[EphelDuath666]

agreed...may have been a better idea to use some of those 25 million bucks and put them into development improvements.

If Valve are on their last limb, other developers are already dead in the ground.

In terms of being a developer they are. Steam is generating money without a doubt, but why aren't they using said money to better their development studios? Why aren't they working on an engine that can compete with today's engines for most AAA titles?

Source engine scales well for older hardware e(i.e. consoles) and they can use spare money on indecent women and large amounts of expensive alcohol.

If Valve are on their last limb, other developers are already dead in the ground.

In terms of being a developer they are. Steam is generating money without a doubt, but why aren't they using said money to better their development studios? Why aren't they working on an engine that can compete with today's engines for most AAA titles?

Source engine scales well for older hardware e(i.e. consoles) and they can use spare money on indecent women and large amounts of expensive alcohol.

That's true about the consoles, but at the same time we have constantly more powerful video cards for PC's and a system like the PS3 which can easily handle anything the PC can. The problem is, if you look at the engine Infinity Ward is using on Modern Warfare 2 and compare it to Left 4 Dead 2 or any of the Half Life games, Valve loses. They cannot compete with the top graphics engines being used today. They spent years working on Source and when they released Half Life 2 back in 2004 it was a damn visual masterpiece. Now, since they keep re-releasing Half Life 2 in various ways (consoles, special packages on Steam) it's most definitely showing its age.

I haven't given L3d2 a proper shot yet, but by looking at the demo and stuff, I think I kinda prefer the looks of the first one.

It kinda looks like they stripped out the stuff that characterised L4D, and to me at least, it just looks really... generic...

That said though, I'll prolly enjoy it anyway.

[EphelDuath666]

That said though, I'll prolly enjoy it anyway.

yeah, that's the sad part...the demo disappointed me but I'll buy it anyways I'm a zombie addict, I guess!